Dr. Kimberly Moore (00:02)
I am Dr. Kimberly Moore, a host of the Envision More Workforce Insight podcast. Join us as we explore workforce and leadership through an innovation lens with leaders from across the country and every industry. Whether you're in education trying to crack the code for workforce or industry seeking to address your workforce talent strategy, for maybe you just need to be inspired. We've got you covered. Tune in, save us as a favorite, and let's innovate together.

of the Workforce Insights podcast. And I am so excited to have with us today as our guest speaker, Emily Fabriato.

Founder at WorkMorphous, an amazing entrepreneur, and you'll get to learn so much more during this conversation. Workforce Insights, just to kind of level set the audience, really is about leaders across the country in a variety of different sectors sharing their insights. And what more important than to bring to you all today an entrepreneur, because again, there are so many innovators, as I'll refer to them, that are choosing this as this opportunity to pursue. are all about problem

and doing it in creative ways. And it's no different today than in our conversation. So Emily, welcome and thank you so much for being

Thank you, Dr. Moore. I'm super excited to be here and to be joined by a fellow entrepreneur and innovator like yourself. Thank you. Super exciting. Yeah, the stars have aligned on that. And I think to just get the juices flowing with our guests, we're going to start it off with you sharing just a little bit with our listeners about your own personal journey. What drove you to the entrepreneurship and what inspired you to start WorkMorphous? Love it. Well,

I, this might sound cliche, but I think the entrepreneurial spirit is within all of us. And, uh, some of us kind of believe that we have it from an early age and others discovered along the way. And my journey was more of a discovery. So actually my first, um, taste of entrepreneurship was when I was 20 in college. Um, and it was, uh, it was actually a pretty fun scenario. I grew up playing ice hockey and as a result of the training, uh, lifting weights and things like that.

In college, had a couple of friends come up to me and ask me about weightlifting and wanted to learn more about how to lift weights and what to eat and meal prep and meal planning and things like that. So I actually ended up effectively running an illegitimate, if you will, personal training and meal plan building business in college. So I was about 20 at the time.

I like to tell that story because it's a fun part of the journey, right? That's the first time I realized that I had a skill set that I was able to bring value to other people's lives and help them in a way that helped their quality of life. That was my first journey into entrepreneurship and the taste of that made me excited about what's possible. But a little bit about my background in workforce development and my entrepreneurship story.

I am very fortunate that I found my passion in workforce development very early on. It's rare that you find people, and I certainly wasn't a person who knows workforce development. It's kind of something you, I feel like a lot of people stumble into, and I stumbled into it early and love it because I have always had a hard time kind of narrowing down my interests, and workforce is just such a unique combination or intersection of policy and business and education and economics. I,

feel very drawn to that. So I started my career working in the office of Governor Kasich, the Office of Workforce Transformation there, and I got exposure to workforce policy and program design. And then ultimately was when the when Governor Kasich was leaving office, he was term limited, we had a new administration came in, I was asked

be the interim director of that office when I was 24, which was a really incredible experience. And that involved working across different agencies with all different stakeholders to design programs, including some of the prominent workforce programs in Ohio today. So I had the opportunity to build a team to really build a new initiative and that felt entrepreneurial in its own way. And what compelled me to start WorkMorphous is

Through that work, I learned that the most effective workforce solutions involve collaboration across sectors. And I felt compelled after getting a taste of that and being on the public sector side of that to help more organizations achieve that through cross -sector workforce and policy consulting, which is what WorkMorphous does today.

I love how your story just evolved because again, there are so many that think that, it's just this hobby thing. I'm not really sure whether it's going to turn into something else, but you start where you are. And honestly, it's a journey that takes you to where you'd like to be. so knowing that it start with the mill prepping to evolving into leading and developing, you know, programs internally for government and administration. I look at that as that whole entrepreneurial effort.

before you sometimes start the entrepreneurial piece. So amazing and such a neat journey there. I would like for the listeners to hear from you and what's been some of your most significant lessons that you've learned along the way relative to leadership, growth and just developing your business. And then we'll get down into the meat and potatoes with the other questions. Sounds great. I love the point about entrepreneurship before entrepreneurship. And it feels amazing to be able to.

go and do that entrepreneurship piece full time. So really exciting to talk to you and hear your journey as well. And lessons in leadership. So one of the quotes that I read recently that I absolutely love is, you're not a leader until you've developed a leader who developed a leader. And I find that so powerful. And particularly because

I wouldn't be where I am today if I hadn't had leaders bet big on me. I was very much an unlikely candidate for all of the positions that I've had the opportunity to be in. And, you know, my first boss took a chance on somebody coming from Arizona to be an Ohio leading policy and, you know, really took that chance on me and believed in me and was a career sponsor. And then my next boss...

Uh, the lieutenant governor really was a career champion for me as well. And he's the reason why I was able to be in a position at a director level at 24. So I feel very privileged and fortunate to have had those opportunities. And to me, leadership is all about paying that forward and being a champion for people who are, you know, maybe young in their career, unlikely candidates in any kind of way. And that's the type of leadership that I strive to,

to emulate every day. You know, such an important nugget. tell individuals that I mentor and I share with them. said, please don't get lost in the likes that you see on social media. What you need as a sponsor, someone that's going to take you into a room that you're not present, but they'll take your name with them.

And I think that's critical for folks to understand because otherwise, you know, you can get lost in this world of, well, you know, I got 20 ,000 likes, but is it, you know, allowing you to move into your destiny? So I love and appreciate the journey that you've had. And I would say to you as well, that that's been mine, you know, people willing to make that investment and give you that opportunity that really catapults you to the next step. So, you know, as I think about workmorphous going from this idea,

to this organization that's birth. And the focus is on strategic planning and policy advising and program development, all focused around maximizing workforce resilience and economic growth. Can you provide our listeners an overview of the current landscape in this sector and any recent trends or changes that have influenced your work and how you're going about

Absolutely. So Dr. Moore, as you know, there are so many trends right now that I feel like we could talk about this for four days on a podcast. But I would be remiss if I didn't acknowledge the rapid technological change that's going on right now. And I don't want to spend a lot of time on that because I know there's a lot of information out there, a lot of news out there, but just the pace of change and the way that emerging technology is changing the skills that we need to succeed in jobs.

and what that means in terms of our ability to all be continuous learners and to constantly seek new skillsets and new upskilling opportunities. And that's one of the biggest things that I enjoy about our work is that we've had the opportunity to help governments and industry organizations design those upskilling programs. So that's a big one. We also have a podcast called Work Morphous Wired. started in November of 2023, so it's relatively new.

But we explore some of those emerging technologies that are impacting the future of work. And we actually interview leading technologists who are experts in their own technology and ask them questions that reveal some actionable insights for non -technical decision makers. if you're ever interested in learning more, we've got a lot of really good conversations with leaders who are pioneering in AI. But

For today's conversation, I'd love to focus on another trend that I feel like is pretty underappreciated. And that is kind of the current state of our economy being in full employment. So national unemployment rate right now, as you know, is 3 .8%. A lot of communities are at full employment. And that is driving a lot of our conversations about a tight talent market, having difficulty finding talent, et cetera.

The point that I think is underappreciated in some of these discussions is that full employment really isn't the full story because the, as the term might, the term might suggest that nearly everyone who is capable of working or wants a job has one, but the reality, as you know, is much more complex. So the unemployment rate does not count people who have been discouraged. They've been unemployed a long time and have stopped looking for

It also overlooks people who are underemployed, perhaps working part -time in jobs that aren't utilizing their skills or that are not paying them adequately because they can't find those full -time opportunities. So one trend that I would really like to see more discussion about is hidden workers. And I'll explain what that means momentarily, but in 2021, this concept really started to arise.

Harvard Business School released a report that estimated there are 27 million hidden workers in the US. And these are people who want to work and are actively seeking work, but often fail with their job seeking efforts because the hiring processes focus on what they don't have, a specific degree or credential. Scraping them out versus screening them in. Yes, exactly.

One of the things that's so important to note about this population of hidden workers, one, there are 27 million of them. So it's not where are the people, it's how do we connect with the people? And the other is that these are people from all backgrounds. I mean, these are military veterans and spouses. These are people who have caregiving responsibilities, people impacted by the criminal legal system, young people who aren't in education or careers, things like that. So I think...

As leaders in workforce development and across sectors that touch workforce in some way, it's really important to do a better job of telling that full story and doing better for hidden workers themselves. employers, for example, can help by reevaluating their hiring processes and removing any unnecessary requirements, asking, does this job actually require a four -year degree? Why?

And then focusing on skills and competencies instead. the term being of course, skills first hiring. Yes, you got it. And then policymakers can help by considering policies that remove these barriers for hidden workers. for example, for let's say military spouses who are moving frequently, licensure can be a barrier and states can adopt reciprocity, meaning that somebody has a barber license in one state

the next state that they move to can accept that license there versus requiring them to redo their training and hours in a new state. And states that do this are wise to do it or communities because if they are more welcoming of talent, they're going to get better and more diverse talent. So that's just a couple of examples, but I really think this is one of the most underappreciated trends and needs of our time.

And we can only address some of these perceived workforce shortages if we're really considering everyone as part of that workforce. I think, you know, one of the, and I should, I want to be transparent with the audience. One of the things that attracted me to not only this conversation and inviting you on as a guest is our collaboration. Now the work that we do, and there is certainly the need and desire for the policy component of it. And then of course, you know,

share passion of designing programs and making sure that they can be implemented and scaled throughout. I think it's just something that those that are involved as a decision -maker and are listening to this episode, which everyone should be tuned in, should appreciate and understand that this is a larger conversation and it's one that we need to take on because again, you hear it throughout industry. They're looking for talent, looking for talent, but.

Are they, you know, when you think about that hidden talent that should not be hidden, that should be uncovered? So there's a unique opportunity, the one that we should challenge each of our, you know, everyone to be a part of that solution and coming up with how we make it a seamless process and make sure that everyone that can work has the desire and willingness to work, does work. So thank you. Thank you for bringing up those trends. Those were powerful.

What do you think, you know, we talk about biggest challenges facing workforce development, and I think we just talked about it when it comes to the worker shortage, but is there anything else that you would point to? And if it's not a challenge, then I guess the flip side of that would be, what do you perceive as the biggest opportunity? You know, and when you think about building a resilient workforce and driving economic growth. I love that question. I think the challenge and opportunity are kind of related, one in the same in a way.

And workforce development is interesting because the concept at its core is so simple, right? It's like aligning supply and demand, supply of talented workers with demand, meaning openings, job openings in the marketplace. And it sounds so simple, but it's a lot harder to do in practice. And the reason it's hard is because there are so many people who need to be involved in that process. Employers need to be able to...

anticipate and communicate skills needs that are emerging, not just today, but in the future. Educators and institutions have to be at the table to be able to hear that and align programming to meet some of those needs that are emerging. Job seekers have to have access to quality information about those jobs, what they pay and where the opportunities exist and the steps in the programs that can help them get there. And then policymakers and governments

need to be able to anticipate the gaps. And I think that's one of the greatest opportunities for policymakers is to fill the gaps where they exist in the market. encouraging behaviors such as employers investing in skills trainings for employees, job seekers taking advantage of the many programs that exist out there. And all of this is to say that no one group can do it alone.

This is why I believe the work that you're doing, the mission that you have, and the work that we're trying to do with cross -sector collaboration is so important. And I always tell people, know, any solution that comes from just one sector might be treating a symptom of the problem, but not the problem itself. No. And that's the challenge and the opportunity here. The challenge is

There's no simple solution and any solution that seems simple, you you can get 40 workers tomorrow, that is solving a symptom of the problem. And the work that we are doing, and that's why I'm so excited to be working and collaborating with you, is addressing some of the root causes of these problems and it's hard work. It takes time. It is not easy to collaborate across sectors.

But when we do it right and we bring the right people together to design solutions, we're changing systems rather than putting a bandaid on some of these challenges that just keep popping up later on if we don't address the root cause of the problem.

And I think that's such an important piece that when I think about what was uncovered by way of the pandemic and then now we operate in this new space where people are working differently and choosing different models. so now it really is this push like never before from employers, like, OK, I'm almost used to people knocking on my door and having tons and tons of applications.

You know, what do we do now and not really having to focus on creating a pipeline that's, you know, for today meet my needs, but also planning for the future. And it's creating, as you say, challenge, but opportunity. So again, for those of you that are listening, regardless of the sector or space that you may be operating in, this is why it's so critical to have this type of talent, expertise, or even I call it an extension of your HR.

of your, you know, really your leadership team and saying, how do we move this forward in a thoughtful way that takes into account the best that we have to offer and brings in all those other pieces? So really good point that you're making there, which is probably a great segue that when we think about, you know, organizations and the work that you're doing and how there's such a demand for it now, you know, innovation is such a driver. Scaling is something that we think about as well.

You know, how has WorkMorphous incorporated innovation and scaling into your approach and serving clients? Yeah, I love that question. And it's fun to be able to talk about the business itself versus just workforce trends, of having a little bit of both. And it's challenging me to really think and reflect upon, you know, we've been in business since 2021 and a lot has changed in that timeframe. So as I was thinking about, you know, how would I answer this question? I think

It comes down to working smarter, not harder. And I know that's also cliche to say, but the way that we're doing that is, know, it's growth as a small business is difficult. And when you grow, you want to make sure that it's sustainable growth. And so what we do is we have a small but mighty team that is very highly skilled and we're doers across different domains. And then we also have, I think, similar to your business model,

a scalable team of experts that we bring in on specific projects who are the best at what they do. And that might be, you know, data visualization, or that might be a specific type of program design, but that allows us to serve the unique needs of our clients and to scale up depending on what that need is without really, you know, changing the organizational structure in a way that might be a little bit too specific for where we are right now. So that's one way.

We also use a lot of technology that helps us be more efficient in our operations. So some of our favorite tools that we use, we use Notion for all of our internal brainstorming and content creation. And there are some cool AI features in that that really helps streamline the process of copy editing and structuring content. We also use a tool called Gamma, which I have no real affiliation with, but it is one of my favorite.

tools ever, it basically set out with a mission to reimagine the PowerPoint. And what it does is it actually will generate a deck for you based on text that you put in. And you can preserve the text that you already wrote, or you can have it generate text for you. But ultimately it designs all the slides for you and it populates them in less than a minute.

which is so I hate to interject, but I could just this visualization just came popped up in my head of people all over smartphones, you know, pens writing down that, my gosh, I don't have to create these decks and there is a way to do it with technology. That's why I love bringing on, you know, leaders like yourself that are really looking at the ways that they build efficiency and through technology. So again,

Great point, but I just imagine, you know, phones being used and sticky pads and notes and everything being pulled out, writing that down. is amazing. And I recommend it to anybody who uses a lot of decks because the last thing we want to do as a company is charge clients for hours spent moving boxes around on a PowerPoint deck. I just don't think that's a good use of time. And because we're using tools that help us be more efficient, we have more time for creative thinking and less time for formatting, which

Really nice. The last point I'll make on this is having a very intentional meeting culture. And some might say that I'm pretty fiercely protective of our schedules, but that is for a reason. We strive to only have meetings that are action and decision oriented, especially with our clients to avoid losing valuable time for strategy work, which is ultimately what we're doing. Right? That's, that's how we create the most value for our clients and our partners. And so we always provide updates.

Asynchronously via email, via tools like Loom, where you can record a video. And that helps us to protect our time for where it matters most in terms of strategy, team building, brainstorming, stakeholder engagement, meaningful opportunities to engage. I love it. So from your perspective, because I know the listeners are gaining a whole lot of insight because you had a lot of experiences along your career journey early.

So what are some of the key ingredients that you believe are important for being an impactful leader and workforce development and economic growth sector? Yeah, I'll come back to the cross sector approach. I think that's really impactful and having that experience can be impactful just to be effective across different areas of workforce development because it is multiple domains. But I also think one of the impactful

leadership traits, if you will, is being a super communicator. And if you haven't read the book Super Communicator, Dr. Moore, actually are, you embody what I believe to be a super communicator. And I'm not just saying that, like now that I've read that book, Having Met You, it just makes sense. It clicks. And some of the attributes of a super communicator, somebody who can speak with clarity, empathy, is a good listener.

and is really absorbing and not only listening to respond, but listening to understand. And that is a critical trait because when you're getting a group of leaders together and education feels like they're being blamed for the workforce challenges and industry feels like nobody's listening to them and you have to be able to navigate that and get everybody aligned and realizing that they're all working toward the same goal. And when we can do that successfully, I think

really elevate our impactful leadership skills as people who can bring a diverse set of stakeholders together toward a goal. And that is the ultimate impact, I think, at least that I've seen in my career in workforce development. That's a great way to share

that it's so important for leaders to have because again, it's not as you describe, you know, one group getting there, you know, you don't get to the prize unless everybody gets there. such a, and again, listeners, heard it, you know, really looking at, you know, how you take that into account, the collaborations, the listening, making sure that everyone understands what their role is. And I think part of everything that you've been talking about throughout,

is really about what you've been able to create not only externally with your clients, but internally with your team too. So company culture will transition there. It plays a significant role in employee satisfaction and performance. then thinking about as a startup founder, how do you ensure that you maintain that positive and supportive company culture? This is something

we're working on every single day and I'm working on every single day and still learning. So I would love to pose that question to a lot of people, including yourself and learn from you as well. But I think some of the key components, definitely transparent, clear and regular communication. Because when you have a small team, you have a lot going on. It's very critical that everybody is getting that clear communication and that they know where the business is headed. So that's important.

Open door policy, being accessible and visible to the team matters and creating space and time for meaningful interactions, including both one -on -one with team members where you can learn from one another and connect on a personal level, but also team building activities. Our team got together in person recently. We're distributed, we're remote and live in different cities, which is a challenge, but it makes it even more special when we're able to get together

brainstorm and really get to know each other outside of work. And then the final point that I'll make is really making decisions that align with our core values. And we're in the process of updating what those are and making sure that they're very clear because we all, whether it's the team members, the contractors, our clients that we work with, we all contribute different perspectives and come from different backgrounds, but we share a set of core values and to have those defined as a company.

makes it a lot easier to build the culture that you want to uphold and to make sure that you are working with the right clients and that they're working with the right consultant because we're not, WorkMorphous is not the right consultant for everyone. Exactly. And having those core values and putting them front and center, which is something we're working toward doing is one way to really find the connections that work the best

the areas where we can collectively make the most impact. So when you think about, know, the success that you've had, how long you all have been up and operating with work more of this, what are, you know, crystal ball, you got the crystal ball, what's in the future of work work more of this, you know, goals and priorities, you know, that's going to drive positive impact and growth. You know, what's on your horizon.

On the horizon, we are looking to expand our portfolio of national policy work. So this is something that we do right now and that we've been learning as we work with more national nonprofits and policy focused clients, that there's an opportunity. when we talk about core values, this is a really fun area for us. When we connect with a national nonprofit or a policy group that

laser focused on a policy cause that we really believe in, such as addressing the benefits cliff or opportunities for those who have been impacted by the criminal legal system, things like that. It is such a great opportunity to bring that policy perspective and work to new markets. So one of our key services and strategies moving forward is

helping national policy organizations with state market entry strategies. So helping them bring their work and their cause to states and make it actionable where it's being implemented from a policy perspective or with employers in the community. And these are all workforce and economic growth related policy priorities. But that is something that we're really excited about and growing the practice in. And I will be relocating from Ohio to Philadelphia.

and much closer to DC and making regular DC trips. So that's something our team is really excited about is continuing to grow the impact by being able to bring great ideas to life in a real state environment. I love it. I am hearing phones ringing. That's your new clients calling, your emails going off about this opportunity because again,

the alignment and the ability to scale. Again, much of the work that I am interested in doing, whether it's on a local, state or national level, policy is so important to have around it, to give it that extra lift. So I love the fact that we have a collaboration and the opportunities that are certainly in that future. And again, for the listeners, hearing how impact can be greater than you ever thought it could be. And I think as we transition

what is actually the final question, but please know that the virtual door is always open for another interview with you. Could you share with our listeners? Because again, we went the different route. This time we went entrepreneurship and we've been hearing from all the different sectors, whether it's been public or private, but entrepreneurs, mean, it's a big thing. So what advice would you give to aspiring entrepreneurs who are looking to make an impact in workforce development in the economic growth sector? Be a sponge.

Really be a sponge, go to events, read studies, introduce yourself to people, have discovery meetings, just ask good questions. And this is such a great collaborative field that people are always willing to take those meetings, take those calls. When people reach out to me on LinkedIn, I almost always say yes, because I love getting to know what people are working on at any phase or any level of organization. And

You never know what comes of that. Sometimes it's an interesting connection that helps somebody in your network with a gap that they had. So I think that's a key part of it is just being open to new conversations and opportunities. would also say, don't be afraid to, if you're in the consulting space, don't be afraid to work with other consultants. We, we refer businesses to our peers or business to our peers all the time. And you know, we, in this field, we're all expert collaborators.

And being able to do that together as peers and, you know, in some cases, competitors is even more powerful. And then last but not least, would say in workforce development, when I started WorkMorphous in 2021, I had to explain to people what workforce consulting was. And now I feel like everybody kind of knows what it is, which is great, but it also indicates that there are a lot of workforce consultants out there. And I

We need that, right? We have a lot of challenges and there's more than enough to really for everyone to be working and thinking about this issue. But if I'm giving advice to those who are entering the workforce space as an entrepreneur, I would say find a niche or two that you're passionate about and become the first or the best at that niche and you will be able to stand out for a long

Such great wisdom, which is what we're about. We're sharing, we're getting the information out. I want to thank our listeners again, such a powerful interview and conversation. I can't wait to follow the journey of WorkMorphous and just the impact that I know that you'll have across the nation and beyond. Listeners, please do remember to not only save it, but certainly subscribe, share. You can join us, whether it be on Apple, whether it be on Google, YouTube.

at Spotify and the list goes on. Please be sure to tune into our next episode. Until then, bye bye.

Thanks for tuning in to the Workforce Insight podcast powered by Envision More Consulting Group, where we bring your bold visions to life. Remember to subscribe, share, and stay tuned for more insights on navigating the world of workforce and leadership. Until the next time, be bold, be great, and let's innovate.